Demonic promises and police betrayals: The tragic story of Bibaa Henry & Nicole Smallman

This week, we unravel the devastating case of Bibaa Henry and Nicole Smallman, two sisters whose lives were tragically stolen during what should have been a beautiful celebration. From their bond as sisters to the horrific failures that compounded their family’s grief, we explore it all—including a killer’s unhinged “demonic pact” and the unforgivable actions of certain officers who were supposed to protect and serve.

But don’t worry, we start off light—venting about life’s infuriating little moments (looking at you, fire doors and car washes), and Hannah’s very pointed disapproval of Rachel’s excessive keyring collection. After the case, we shift gears with some good vibes, podcast updates, and the usual dose of chaotic chatter.

Grab a drink (trust us, you’ll need it for this one) and join us as we tackle one of the hardest stories we've told, with a sprinkle of South London humour to keep us sane.

Sources for this episode include:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/oct/28/danyal-hussein-jailed-for-35-years-for-murdering-sisters-in-london-park

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-59068720 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_of_Bibaa_Henry_and_Nicole_Smallman 

https://www.womensaid.org.uk/womens-aid-response-to-the-sentencing-of-danyal-hussein/ 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/12/london-sisters-nicole-smallman-bibaa-henry-murdered-stranger-police 

https://www.policeconduct.gov.uk/sites/default/files/documents/Operation%20Turton%20-%20PUBLICATION%20COPY%20-%202022.pdf 

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Produced and hosted by Hannah Williams & Rachel Baines
Mixed & edited by Purple Waves Sound (A.K.A Will)

Transcript

Bibaa & Nicola

Hello. Hi. I'm Rachel.

I'm Hannah. And this is the Synod stuff podcast. A podcast all about the treacherous, the threatening, the terrifying and the terrorizing.

I got another T word. I could have just terrifying. Did I not say terrifying? Oh, I don't know.

I wasn't listening. Oh, fair. But yeah, it's all about those things in South London.

But it is that it is. How are you? I'm fine. This is fine.

This is for everything. It's fine. No, look, I need to stop whinging so much.

It could be worse. And I need to check myself before I wreck myself really. We are also allowed to just be like, oh, just the wild are dumped.

The earth is here. Exactly. Exactly.

I can't speak. Honestly, the world is a dumpster fire and small inconveniences in my life are popping up. I like being able to fucking talk.

I'm popping up all over the place. And then some bigger things underlying happening that just mayor. Yeah, which is hard.

But that's life. It doesn't kill you makes you stronger. It does indeed.

That's Kelly Clarkson. Yeah. So I look, I'm fine.

And it's, I hate it when podcasts host do this. And she meant less than half a minute. But they won't talk about what it is.

Okay. Yeah, actually, are you going to explain to the people? Why? Why? Maybe on the Patreon. Are we talking about the Patreon? Yeah.

Okay. I think we did last episode. And we're definitely doing the next one because we do not record these in a funny direction.

But yeah, look, it is what it is. Mentally, I'm probably at a... 40 out of 100. Okay.

But that's not 30 out of 100. It's true. Yeah.

It's not. And, you know, I am being proactive in my own life to get myself back up to a solid 70. Nice.

I mean, 65 to 70s, I think my vague base level for happiness. That's what I'm allowed. I like it.

It's a good, it's a good, I mean, to be fair with me. It's like they will revoke my goth badge. Yeah, that's right.

If I go anything above 55. There's always got to be some element of doom and and claim. And it's also why I align myself with Eeyore.

What? I align myself with Eeyore. Oh, Eeyore. Eeyore.

So I align myself with Eeyore. Oh, me and the Eeyore. We love it.

No, with Eeyore. The AA Milled character. Yes.

I'm with you. I'm on board. Yes.

So I think 70 is, I mean, good on you. Good on you. No, in my scale that I have created, everyone should be at 100.

100 isn't like euphoria. 100 is just like, I'm happy in my life and everything's fine. Oh, okay.

Well, yeah, no, still. But not the shit version of the shit meaning of fine. The actual meaning of fine.

Yeah, again, I'm pretty certain the golf card would be revoked. And listen, it's my scale. I mean, that's fine.

That's fair. Don't take this away from me. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm very close.

I'm really sorry. I was also going to say that I love the fact that I still think I've got a golf card. Yeah.

Because, but you know, no, it'd be a golf key ring anyway. It would be a golf key ring and always always at heart. Do you know what, right? I will lose the fucking keys.

I've had it. I've had it with you. I've had it with my mum.

I've had it with everybody I know in life telling me off for having a massive bundle of keys. Just you and your husband walk around like your caretakers of a prison. He's stopped now.

Even he's turned against me. He's now got two sets of keys. The keys that are on his fob thingy.

Yeah. That is literally the car key and the house keys. And that is it.

And then he's got another set of keys which are for the tiny offish shed and like spare ones. Yeah. But no, so he only walks around with three keys on a lanyard.

As it should be. It's very, no, no. If it doesn't do this, Jesus Christ, it upsets me so much.

If it doesn't do that, you're not doing it right. I would lose. You're going to break the ignition column in your car.

That's how heavy your car key is. Do you know what it is? And honestly, I would just lose them. I can't be like trusted with one key.

No, I don't want to say one key. I'd like have the keys that you need in order to get into the places you need keys for. What you don't need is four thousand key rings.

One, two, this is great. Three, four, five. No, come on.

Six, six. Come on. There's more there.

I can see them. Seven, seven, seven. No, what's that one down there? Oh, that's come off of something.

Eight. I've lost something. You've got eight key rings Rachel.

Eight. Yeah, and they sit in my bag and I know where they are. Eight key rings.

You know what? Leave me and my fantasies of being a jailer alone. No. Deporable.

Deporable. Yeah. Yeah.

It's really wide to be up. You know this. I know.

This is why I do it purposely just by another key ring. Find another reason to put one on and see how long it takes you to notice. It's usually about point seven of a second.

It's like a bat signal to me. Like I wake up in the night. Like she's ordered a key ring.

I know she has. Yeah. Yeah.

Also, you are a digital marketer. Yeah. You know that those loyalty cards are all available via apps and in Google Wallet or whatever you use.

Correct. You do not need them on your keys either. So they're redundant key rings.

So what does that take up to? So the other thing, right, that we have to remember and that the Trevor's may have gotten onto but might not know, is that I am lazy. So taking from lobbying them around with you all the time. No, the idea, the concept of like taking a key ring off of my keys is just like, well, where will I put it then? It goes on keys.

So it lives on the keys. You don't take a key ring off unless it's broken and then you put it in the bin. I'm going to smash all your key rings.

I'm going to smash all your key rings. Okay. Fucking perfect.

Oh, dear. What is mine? Oh, nothing. You're perfect.

Get that on a key ring. No, I was going to say when you asked me how I was. I am feeling a little bit like my car did last Saturday when we decided to take it to a I went to the supermarket.

The girls spotted the car wash machine. There was an episode of Bluey where they go into the car wash machine and they call it the hairy monster attack. The girls have been begging me to take them to a hairy monster attack.

We were at the supermarket. There was a hairy monster attack. The car has not been cleaned.

Killing about 18 step birds in one stone, but I'm so fun. We go into the car wash, does its thing cost me seven pound 80 and then we come out of it and as the machines come over, I've got those wing mirrors that are like you press a button and they go in. And as the machine was coming over, it knocked the wing mirrors in and I was a little bit like all shit because they're electric.

They meant to just bend in like that. I don't know. So that was the first fear.

And then we finished in the hairy monster attack. We drove home. I got home.

I got out of the car. I looked at the car and the one bit of the car that had been annoying the living shit out of me for being so dirty because it'd been green. You know when you get like the moldy like moss stuff, right? That's what it looks like.

Where the hairy monster attack thing had pushed the wing mirrors in, everything else, lovely and shiny. Apart from just those two strips on either wing mirror, there was still bright green. And that about sums up my life at the moment.

So dirty, dirty, dirty life. You are dirty. Just incredibly frustrating and very small things are like what the fuck are you? I'm one kind of like pencil break from murder potentially.

Like that's how small things are just like, I'm like no, fuck off. Everything fuck off. I screamed at the door the other day.

It wouldn't stay open. It's not meant to. It's a fire door.

But I wouldn't stay open and I was trying to carry the bin bag through to take it out. Yeah, I'm fucking just trying to open and I'm trying to get out. Just trying to get out.

Oh, yeah, I hate it. Fuck you. No.

Essentially what we're saying to have is that if the year could just be over, yeah, if it could just end up, that would be divine. I'm so tired. Anyway, anyway.

Have you got a story for me? I do. I do. And it's fucking infuriating and terrifying and terrible and sad.

Okay. So, you know, business is usual. Nice.

But yeah, trigger warnings for violence, for prejudice, for systematic failures, for radicalization. Oh, okay. For people being the worst.

All of that stuff basically. Okay. So today, yeah, today I'm going to tell the story of Bieber Henry and the Coles woman.

Okay. Mm-hmm. So, on a warm June evening in 2020, two sisters, Bieber Henry and the Coles woman, gathered with friends in Bryant Country Park in northwest London.

I can't pronounce it because it's in the wrong side of London. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is the wrong side of London.

And just traverse, I am aware. Okay. I am aware.

Don't worry about it. Just just be patient. Just you just wait.

Okay. Cheers. So, yeah, so they had gathered with friends in Bryant Country Park in northwest London to celebrate Bieber's 46th birthday.

The celebration was filled laughter, joy and photographs capturing their love for life. What began as a simple, joyous occasion turned into a heartbreaking tragedy and left a family shattered and a community reeling. Bieber and Nicole were not just victims though.

They are beloved daughters, sisters and friends. And their story became emblematic of the ongoing fight against gender-based violence, systematic failures in policing and the dark realities of radicalization in the digital age. So, who were these women? Bieber Henry and Nicole's woman were sisters, but more than that, those close to the pair described their deep and unwavering friendship.

They shared an extraordinary bond, which was often described, they were often described as inseparable. Bieber, born in 1974, was a dedicated and accomplished social worker. Known for her unwavering compassion, she worked tirelessly to protect vulnerable children and families in her role at Buckinghamshire Council.

Her colleagues often described her as a relentless advocate, someone who believed in giving people second chances and guiding them towards better futures. She had a natural ability to connect with people, one co-worker shared, and her passion for justice inspired everyone around her. Bieber's friends and family remember her as vibrant and full of life, with a sharp wit and infectious laugh.

Outside of work, she loved hosting gatherings, bringing people together and creating memories. Her sister and Nicole would often say that Bieber was the heart of the family. A role she embraced with love and care.

Her mother, meaner-smallman, described Bieber as a pocket-sized dynamo, barely five-foot, stylish, street-wise and a devoted social worker. She had an adult daughter and was about to become a grandmother. Oh, God.

Nicole, born in 1992, had gone to a performing arts school, was a talented musician and a natural-born hippie. She carried a natural flair for the arts. She was a freelance photographer and she had an eye for capturing the beauty in everyday moments.

Her photographs often reflected her vibrant personality, blending bold creativity with a sense of warmth and intimacy. Friends recall her as someone who lit up every room she entered, always eager to make others laugh. She had a way of making you feel like the most important person in the world, a friend shared.

The sisters were daughters of meaner-smallman, a trailblazer, as the Church of England's first black female archdeacon. Oh, wow. Meena instilled in her daughters a strong sense of justice, resilience and faith, qualities they carried into their own lives.

She described Bieber and Nicole as beautiful souls who were not just sisters but best friends. It's quite a big age gap, though, between the two of them. Yeah, and there's a third sister as well.

Okay. I think her name's Monica, but it has immediately left my brain if that's true or not, sorry. No, no.

I think she lives in Holland. Oh, okay. So, yeah.

On the 5th of June, 2020, Bieber Henry decided to celebrate her birthday in Bryant Country Park, a tranquil green space in northwest London, in order to adhere to COVID lockdown restrictions. The celebration began with a picnic surrounded by friends, laughter and the soft glow of fairy lights. Photographs from the evening, later recovered, captured the joy and warmth of the event.

As the night deepened and friends began to leave, Bieber and Nicole decided to stay behind, extending their sisterly time together. They took selfies together with their final photos showing the women smiling, embracing both the moment and each other. When Bieber and Nicole didn't return home, their loved ones grew concerned.

Calls went unanswered and fears began to mount. The following day, family and friends reported the missing to the police. Despite the family being adamant, something must have happened to the pair, who had always been great at staying in touch with their nearest and dearest.

The initial response from the police was described as at best dismissive. We'll talk more about that later, don't you worry. Mina's woman, their mother, later revealed that police failed to conduct an immediate search despite saying there was a search planned.

It got really convoluted. But it just compounded the family's anxiety. Of course it would have.

So faced with a lack of urgency that left them feeling helpless, the family decided to initiate their own searches and outreach. So Nicole's boyfriend, Adam Stone, was determined to find answers and went to foreign country park himself. As he searched the vast area, he spotted something in the undergrowth, a horrifying discovery that would forever alter the lives of everyone who knew Bieber and Nicole.

Their bodies had been concealed and it was clear that they had been brutally attacked in an act of incomprehensible violence. Adam later gave emotional testimony at the old Bailey during the trial, which we'll get to later, describing his desperate search for Nicole and her sister. He explained that just after 1am on June the 6th, he had received a final text message from Nicole, reading, I'm dancing in a field.

When she failed to respond to his reply later that day, and her family and friends had said no one had heard anything, his concern just grew and grew. Mr Stone told the court that he reported Nicole missing to the police and attempted to track her mobile phone, but his efforts were unsuccessful. By the morning of Sunday the 7th of June, he decided to search the area himself, heading to a foreign country park where the sister had last been seen.

He was accompanied by his parents. Speaking at the trial from behind a screen, Mr Stone recounted, I spoke to my mum and said we need to go looking. I received a message from Nicole's mum with the address of where they had gone.

Once at the park he and his parents separated to cover more ground, calling out and checking the bushes as they searched. He described the moment he made the horrifying discovery. The second I saw the knife, I started running.

I already had my phone ringing 999. As he continued searching, he noticed a pair of shoes. He ran further into the bushes and then horrifyingly found the bodies of Bieber and Nicole.

When asked if he touched the bodies, he replied no, I just fell to my knees in front of Nicole. I know it's fucking just mind-blowingly awful, isn't it? At the trial, pathologist Virginia Fitzpatrick Swallow presented the findings from the post-mortem examinations of Bieber and Nicole. She explained that Nicole's woman had been stabbed 28 times and several of the wounds indicated she had attempted to fight off her attacker.

Additionally, marks on her body were consistent with being dragged. Oh God. Mrs Fitzpatrick Swallow stated that Nicole had died from injuries to her lungs.

Wow, okay. Bieber Henry, the court herd, had sustained six stab wounds with injuries to her chest, groin and back. Three of the wounds had pierced her heart and lungs, causing fatal damage.

One particularly severe stab wound measuring about 15 centimetres had penetrated her breastbone. Bark! With the pathologist describing that as requiring severe force. Yeah.

Get free of bloody breastbone Christ. So, police sergeant Andrew Marsh was the first police supervisor on the scene. His responsibility was to secure the immediate scene and decide on the boundary needed to preserve any and all evidence.

An area was established with police staff stationed at certain points to create a human kind of chain barrier to keep out people and wildlife. Two of these points were labelled as AMB. PS Marsh said, sadly we needed officers positioned close to the bodies of the women to prevent wildlife interfering with the scene.

These points were effectively within an inner cordon. There was a thick head row where the women's bodies were positioned. It may have been possible to just about make out the bodies of the women from the fixed point B. But this would have been tricky and you would need to know what you were looking for.

Or you'd have to leave point B. It would not have been possible to see the bodies from fixed point A. Right. If you wanted to see the bodies you would need to stray away. Right.

So why is this relevant and important? PC Denno's Jaffa was assigned to the inner cordon position A. And PC Jamie Lewis was assigned to the same inner cordon at position B. These officers were tasked with maintaining the integrity of the immediate area surrounding the victims. However, what they did instead was utterly and unimaginably vile. Oh god.

So later a Met Police tribunal heard Jaffa and Lewis had described the sisters as dead birds. So during the night of the 8th of June, Jaffa took four pictures of Nicole and Bieber's bodies in situ and Lewis took two pictures, then superimposed his face onto one of them to create a selfie style image. What? Jaffa sent an inexperienced officer, an inexperienced officer at the photographs of the sisters' bodies as they lie intertwined in the bushes.

He then showed images to two other officers, including a probationary officer. He was supposed to be mentoring. What the fuck's like? On the 19th of June, 2020, an anonymous tip-off about Lewis was given to the police watchdog.

Jaffa was arrested three days later. The defendants were members of a WhatsApp group called A Team, which was composed of 41 Met officers. Jaffa was also in a WhatsApp group with nine other people who were not in the force.

Oh god. Shortly after arriving on the scene, Lewis posted to the A Team WhatsApp group an article about the discovery of the bodies, saying he and his colleagues were living the Wembley dream. What? Lewis wrote, unfortunately, I'm sat next to two dead birds full of stab wounds.

Oh. Pleasant. Jaffa posted on the smaller WhatsApp group, I have pictures of the two dead victims, let me know who doesn't want to see them.

Jaffa also sent a photo of the bodies to a former colleague with the message, this is what I have to deal with, while Lewis sent WhatsApp messages about the sisters to seven people who were not police officers. Oh my god. The Independent Office for Police Conduct, the IOPC, launched an investigation dubbed Operation Turton to assess the officer's actions.

And you can read the whole, I'll link it in the show notes. You can read the whole report. The inquiry revealed that both officers had violated multiple standards of professional behavior.

I'd say so. Including duties and responsibilities by failing to respect the sanctity of a crime scene, confidentiality for sharing sensitive and distressing images and discreditable conduct, acting in a way that brought the Met into disrepute. Yeah, 1,000%.

The officer's actions were not isolated mistakes, but deliberate breaches of their professional and ethical obligations. Jaffa and Lewis were arrested on suspicion of misconduct in a public office and were subsequently dismissed from the force. Good.

In December of 2021, both officers were sentenced to prison terms, which was a rare but critical demonstration of accountability for such egregious behavior. Well, yeah, and too damn bloody right. For Mina Smallman, the mother of Bieber and Nicole, this misconduct compounded the family's grief.

Quote, those police officers dehumanised our children. She said speaking out about the profound disrespect on violation their actions represented. Her calls for justice and systematic reform resonated with many, reigniting discussions about the culture within law enforcement and the urgent need for change.

The incident only highlighted failures in individual accountability, but also underscored dramatic issues within policing. The Met faced widespread criticism, prompting commitments to improving internal culture and conduct. For the small one family, however, no apology or reform could undo the harm caused by these officers' actions.

And there's a bit more to that. I'll come to you later as well. Okay.

So now, back to the 8th of June, 2020, with the, so full and intensive purposes. The crime scene is secured and the forensic teams arrived to begin their examination of the area. Officers and forensic specialists searched for physical evidence that could lead to the identification of the perpetrator.

Items recovered at the scene included a knife believed to have been used in the attack, a pair of sunglasses near the bodies, and drag marks on and near Nicole Smallman's body, suggesting an attempt by the perpetrator to move or conceal her. Investigators collected swabs from the knife handle and other surfaces for DNA analysis, suspecting that the attacker may have injured himself during the assault. Forensic scientists identified blood samples at the scene that did not match the victims, which obviously is a vital clue.

These samples were quickly processed and entered into the national DNA database. As this evidence was being processed, the investigative team worked on building a profile of the perpetrator. The level of violence and apparent randomness of the attack pointed to a chilling level of premeditation.

Police reviewed CCTV footage from the nearby areas, although the parks included location presented challenges in tracing movements. Digital data, including foam pings and geolocation records, were also analysed to identify anyone who had been near the park at the time of the murders. Also during this period, the police issued a public appeal for information, urging anyone who might have seen or heard anything unusual in the area on the night of the 5th to come forward.

Despite the appeal, initial leads were sparse and the police faced mounting pressure to deliver answers. And then on the 1st of July 2020, the results of the DNA searches came back with a familial match. I was a bit busy on that day.

Oh, you were giving birth. I was. To the second one.

Second one. Yeah. The second one on the first and the first one on the second.

Yeah. Cool. So yeah.

So the results of the, it was a familial match. Right. And it led them to Daniel Hussein or Danielle Hussein.

Okay. I'm not quite sure on the pronunciation. I'm going with Danielle.

Fine. An 18 year old man living in Southeast London. Oh.

See. Good things come to those who wait, although I'm not entirely certain that Danielle is a good thing. Terrible.

Terrible. Terrible, awful thing. And Daniel was identified as the prime suspect immediately.

Detectives began building a case against him. Surveillance footage from nearby locations and records of Hussein's movements on the night of the murders corroborated his connection. Yeah.

Police also sought to understand Hussein's motives and background, which would later reveal a chilling and premeditated plan rooted in occult beliefs. Oh. So in the early hours of the first July, 2020, um, not the second of July, 2020.

Sorry. Armed police descended on a quiet cul-de-sac in Blackheath, Southeast London. Well, and Blackheath is a nice but a selfless under.

Some reports also said this is the most official thing I could find. So Blackheath, some said Elton. Oh, okay.

Goodbye. So. Both lovely areas.

Very lovely. Very, very lovely. Although some way away from each other.

No. Not really. Only what? That, uh, you go down past the bingo in Elton, then you're at Kidbrook bit.

Yeah. True, true, true, true, true. Yeah.

I think I'm thinking of it from the other side of Blackheath. Yeah. I'm thinking about the bus that we used to get back to yours from school to 86.

Yeah. But I used to go down by, uh, the sun and the sun. And all that.

Oh, yeah. That's silly bus route. Um, so yeah.

So they, the armed police descended, um, on a house in Blackheath. They forced entry into the family home executing a warrant as part of their investigation. Inside the house, officers recovered, officers discovered a chilling document that revealed the disturbing beliefs of Danielle Hussein, who was just three weeks past his 18th birthday at the time of the murders.

Bloody hell. Written in large, almost childlike handwriting. This piece of paper detailed what Hussein believed to be a binding contract with a demonic entity.

The agreement, um, outlined his promise to perform a minimum of six sacrifices, every six months, for as long as I am free and physically capable. Oh my God. The contract was addressed to the, to the mighty king, Lucy Fus Rofakale? No.

Lucy Fus Rofakale. Lucy Fus Rofakale. A figure recognized in certain satanic practices as a demon associated with wealth and governance.

Oh, I don't know enough about my satanic practices. There you go. That's why they're taking my golf card, exactly.

In return for the sacrifices Hussein, um, expected to receive fruitful rewards, including immense wealth, power and success in winning the mega million super jackpot. As he put it. Oh, hang on.

Hang on. A 17 year old lad has committed a double murder of two innocent women because he made a pact with a made up devil to win the lottery. Yep.

And he was going to do four more. He was going to do six women. He was going to murder, not do, sorry.

He was going to murder six women every six months. And while he was. And be rewarded with wealth.

You wait. Okay. Um, Hussein had signed his first name at the bottom of the page, um, using his own blood.

Beside his signature, a blank space remained seemingly reserved for the demons mark. In another note found in his room, Hussein offered blood to demon queen Blithe in exchange for making a girl at his school fall in love with him. Oh, okay.

So who was Danielle? Danielle Hussein was born in 2001 and was a British national of Iraqi descent, presiding in black youth. In October of 2017, at the age of 15, while attending Thomas Talis. Oh, fuck.

Okay. Daniel's online activities. Daniel's online activities raised significant concerns among his teachers.

He was found accessing far right propaganda on school computers, which included extreme extremist content promoting racial hatred and violence. This behavior led to his referral to the prevent program. So the prevent program is a key component of the UK's counter terrorism strategy known as contest.

It aims to identify and support individuals at risk of radicalization, intervening early to prevent them from becoming involved in terrorism or extreme activities. Prevent works with schools, local authorities, healthcare providers and community organizations to address underlying vulnerabilities and provide tailored interventions. It focuses on safeguarding individuals from being drawn into harmful ideologies promoting understanding and awareness and fostering resilience against radicalization through education, mentoring and social support.

Nicely well done. So Daniel was put on the channel program for the most concern, which is for the most concerning prevent cases. Right.

But they discharged him in 2018, although he was seen again six months and then 12 months later. As part of that original program. Yeah.

Or additional. The channel program involves a multi agency panel responsible for assessing the risk posed by a referred person. The program is then charged with developing a support plan for the individual concerned.

Okay. Despite this intervention, Hussein's troubling online behavior persisted. He developed an interest in occult practices and became involved in online satanic forums where he was exposed to extremist ideologies.

This digital environment appeared to have a profound influence on his actions. Hmm. During his police interviews, Hussein exhibited a notable lack of cooperation.

He declined to answer questions and did not provide any explanation for the evidence against him. When asked about the injuries to his hand, which were consistent with defensive wounds from the victims, he claimed that they were the result of a robbery. Additionally, Hussein mentioned having asperges his words, sister syndrome and memory problems, although he did not elaborate on these claims.

He denied being the killer and put forward a series of very bizarre suggestions, basically saying how he'd been framed, claiming that his face had been photoshopped onto the CCTV footage, that the real killer was out there and that all of the evidence found at his family home had been planted. Mate, no one cares about you that much. So the investigation into Danielle's crimes also faced significant challenge when detectives were unable to access his internet browsing history on the electronic devices recovered from his bedroom.

Okay. So in an effort to gain this critical information, authorities reportedly sought assistance from the US Department of Justice, but were denied. What? I know.

Lead investigator, D.I. Simon Hardin expressed his frustrations stating, I find it incredibly frustrating to run a murder inquiry with your hands tied behind your back in that way. But regardless of the challenges, it did go to trial and the trial commenced on the 9th of June 2021 at the Old Bailey. Prosecutors presented compelling evidence, including the DNA matches linking Hussein to the crime scene and the murder weapon.

The handwritten contract was of course a focal point illustrating his belief in a packed gain wealth through sacrifices. The court heard how over the 10 days following the murders, he spent more than 160 quid on lottery tickets and bets, but all without success. Christ.

The jury was presented with the evidence showing that the blood found at the park was a billion times more likely to belong to Daniel Hussein than to anyone else. Additionally, there was the CCTV footage that captured him around the area, but also captured him purchasing a set of knives from Azda the day before the murders. Despite the overwhelming evidence Hussein still maintained his innocence.

During his trial, he opted not to give evidence leaving his lawyers to put forward his defence case and no evidence of mental health difficulties were aired. Hang on. So the defence team didn't try and use mental health as a mitigating circumstance.

That's interesting. However, Daniel Hussein was found guilty of the murders of Bieber Henry and a Coles woman. The jury took just over eight hours to deliver their unanimous verdict, rejecting Hussein's claims of being framed.

After the guilty verdict, Mrs. Justice Whipple ordered a psychiatric assessment of the teenager to try and get a better understanding of his mental state before sentencing. The doctor found a striking oddness in the crimes, suggested further tests and confirmed that Hussein is on the autistic spectrum. Right.

So on the 28th of October 2021, Daniel was sentenced to life imprisonment with a minimum term of 35 years before being eligible for parole. During sentencing, the judge described the murders as a frenzied and calculated attack, motivated by Hussein's delusional belief in a demonic pact. The judge stated, and I quote, autistic spectrum disorder does not explain why you committed these offences and it does not explain your refusal to acknowledge your offending.

You know what you did that night and you choose to lie about it and conduct your defence on the basis of that lie. Yep. Well said.

The court emphasised the severity of his crimes and the profound impact on the victim's family and friends, ensuring that Hussein would spend decades behind bars for his actions. After sentencing, Hussein's own barrister, um, Royal Calmy Jones Casey, conceded that there are, quote, many unanswered questions over the double murder, suggesting that the truth may eventually emerge during the killer's decades behind bars. We hope in time and after treatment, the family of the two women so tragically lost will get some answers as to how and why the offences came to happen, she said.

In a victim impact statement read out in the court, the sister's mother, Mina, said, no one expects their children to die before them, but to have two of your three children murdered overnight is just incomprehensible. It's fucking awful. If any good comes out of this, at least another four women will not meet a similar end in a so-called pact with a so-called demon.

So the handling of Bieber and Nicole's disappearance by the met sparked outrage, particularly from Mina, who described the level of service provided as deeply inadequate. She was convinced that, had her daughters been white, the police would have searched the park and Jaffa and Lewis would not have been able to take the photographs of her daughters. Hearing how the officers violated Bieber and Nicole, she felt she had lost them for a second time.

Quote, I hadn't even imagined what they looked like until we were told the officers had taken photographs. I began to have flashes of what I thought they might look like. Your kids are murdered and then you hear this.

In the natural order of things, you would say the kids being murdered is the worst thing. However, when you are hanging on to that as a life raft, trying to keep yourself together to function, get up, dress, do what you've got to do. When that happened, the photographs, any reserves that we had were stripped away.

Oh, Mina. The IOPC's investigation into the police's response uncovered a series of failings that further compounded the family's grief. The investigation revealed that a duty inspector had closed the police logs after receiving the initial information about the sisters possible whereabouts rather than initiating a search or starting any investigation.

What, so they closed it before they'd even done anything? They opened the log, received the information that they were in this specific park in Wembley. Close the log. There's also, there's another bit where a call handler, and it's on tape obviously, refers to one of the systems as a suspect.

Oh, fuck's sake. And then I couldn't get another source to corroborate this. So I don't know how true this bit is, but also apparently, where Nicole lived, no.

Where Bieber lived, I thought, oh, fuck, sorry. I can't remember which sister it is. One of them lived it on an estate, which was quite notorious.

And again, the police were like, look, she lives around there. Doesn't really matter, does it? Kind of thing. It's fucking disgusting.

Oh, my God. But despite these findings, the IOPC concluded that the police's conduct, while unacceptable, was not influenced by racial or class bias. Oh, of course.

Of course. Because that fuck off. This assertion was met with skepticism for Mina, who openly criticised the IOPC's ability to independently hold the police accountable.

It can't. It can't. She described them as the three blind monkeys, here no evil, see no evil, speak no evil.

Arguing that the IOPC lacked true independence, particularly in its investigations into the Met Police. The IOPC investigation underscored a culture of defensiveness within the force, with officers reluctant to acknowledge failings or take responsibility for systematic shortcomings. Fuck's sake.

However, and kind of mind-blowingly, despite the brutality of her daughter's murders, Mina says she had forgiven her killer, forgiven their killer, Daniel Hussein, viewing him instead as just a sick individual. However, she cannot forgive the two police officers, Jaffa and Louis. When the two police officers responsible for taking unauthorized photographs of her daughter's bodies were sentenced to 33 months in prison, after pleading guilty to misconduct in public office, Mina expressed her willingness to meet them as part of the restorative justice programme.

Right. However, instead, Mina was forced to return to court as the officers unsuccessfully appealed their sentences. Oh, for God's sake.

The experience left Mina feeling overwhelmed by the stress. I had palpitations and my head was pounding. I thought to myself, am I going to have a heart attack or a stroke here and now? She said she was appalled by the defence arguments, which trivialised the misconduct.

Claims included that the photographs were only shared with close friends and would not have spread any further, and that taking selfies was just something people did to document their activities. Yeah, if your activities, one barrister even argued how imprisonment would affect Jaffa's teenage daughters, seemingly oblivious to the insensitivity of this plea, given the trauma inflicted on Mina's family. Fucking hell.

Like, are these people tone deaf? It's fucking insane, right? How do you? What? What? Yeah, you take a selfie when you're at a theme park. You take a selfie when you're in a pub toilet. In a pub toilet.

Yeah. You take selfies when you're doing things that not when you're guarding the victims of murder. Exactly.

Fuck you. It's just insane, right? Oh, his poor daughters. I mean, yeah, you should have fucking thought about your daughters.

How would you like that if that had been your kids and that had happened? Would you want you guarding your children? No. Fuck you. And it's only, it's only close relatives, only close friends.

Okay. Oh, well, but still raw. Oh, my God.

So, yeah, like I said, initially, Mina had been willing to mean with them and like kind of give them the benefit of the doubt. However, she then withdrew her offer to meet them after the appeal, stating, if they'd served their time without complaining, I would understand that they had repented. But when they challenged the sentence, I thought that was bullshit.

Good. Well said, Mina. So, Mina explained that the Guardian journalist, Simon Hatterstone.

It's a brilliant article that she goes, like, it's an interview with her. But yeah, it's brilliant. So, when asked why she had originally agreed to meet them, Mina said, I've said all along that I don't need to meet with them to bring me peace.

I wanted to be a mirror so that they could look at the mother of the two girls they took photos of. I froze the request because I don't want them to use it as part of their defence. Yeah.

It's fucking awful enough. So, another sad impact of this case is that Mina's sister Anne passed away shortly after the murders. Quote, I think Bieber's murder finished her, Mina said, and had been battling cancer for five years and shared a particularly close bond with Bieber.

Mina was quoted as saying, she wanted to talk about her and I couldn't do it. I was broken. I couldn't even go to Anne's funeral because it was only a few months after the girls, and I couldn't go back there.

So yeah, Bieber Henry and Nicole Smallman were vibrant, creative and deeply compassionate women whose lives were tragically cut short. Yet even in the face of unimaginable grief, their story has become a catalyst for change. Mina Smallman's tireless advocacy has ensured that her daughter's lives are remembered not just for the brutality of their deaths, but for the beauty and impact they brought to those around them.

And there's a great, Mina's done a kind of documentary and called Two Daughters. And yeah, and several articles and she's kind of been spearheading trying to get reform and change within the Met as well. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, she's a powerhouse of all of them. I can imagine.

Do you know the thing that doesn't surprise me? But what upsets me more than anything is the fact that actually Mina, us sitting here in the tiny shed, the vitriol is not on the person who killed them. It's on the people violated them after death. Like it's just obviously I'm not saying that Danielle should have done what he did.

He's a fucking monster, but he's quite obviously not well. And that doesn't excuse it, but that's what Mina said. A sick individual has obviously been unwell.

Like there is something wrong with him. There is something wrong with those policemen. There's something inherently disgusting about them.

I just don't understand like what? Like, OK, I'm going to say something that's going to sound really weird. But like hear me out before you judge me. Like, I can almost understand taking a selfie of yourself when you've just like stopped a massive cocaine shipment and taking a fight with your friend.

Look at me. Look at me. Or like in front of a gun of guns or money or whatever.

I can kind of see. I can get that. I still think you shouldn't do it, but like you can.

I can almost understand that. Why? Unless they're just so desensitized to that. But like, why would you even want those photos? I know.

And then sending them on, sending them into a WhatsApp with other professionals. Like, it's just, but also how fucking thick? Oh, I'm going to do something that I know I shouldn't do. And then I'm going to give it to 41 other people who have the ability to shop me in.

Well, that's just other police officers. There was also to friends and family. But that's the thing.

Like, if it's gone to police officers who know that you shouldn't do that, and you would hope that not all 41 of them didn't have a conscience. And it, because it's anonymous, it's, I didn't say it. Like, it's rumored that the whistleblowing that happened about the pictures didn't come from a police officer.

Of course it didn't. Why is that unsurprising? Oh, mate. Just, it's just horrific.

And it's big cases and there's so much in there. And to unpick. So there's that police misconduct.

But there's also the fact that they didn't fucking go and search. No, no, no. Like, what? And they, like, closed the log when they heard of the area where it was.

It's just, I mean, this is the thing, right? Why, you're paid to do a job. And it's very clear, if you're a police person, your job is to protect the people in the area where you serve. So if someone calls up and says, my daughters are missing and I need help, what you do is provide help.

That is your job. Yep. How, how, just, oh, it's so frustrating.

Just fucking do something. Anything. And you imagine, right? I'm not bringing it back to South London because, you know, I know we did venture across the river.

But, like, can you imagine, like, if police in South London did that? Oh, it's the ferryer. Nah. We won't be going there.

Like, everyone would be dying exactly. Like, every day. I don't know how people do.

But, you know what I mean? Like, it would be a million times worse. Like, there are parts of South London that are not nice places to go. And I am sure that the police would rather avoid going there.

But you know what? It's your fucking job. Tough. Do a better job, generally.

It wouldn't be such a bad area, would it? Just fucking out. Well, thank you, mate. That was a tough old one to get through.

There's so much. And I feel like I might not have done it justice because there's so much in it. I think, personally, I think you did it justice.

I know about the case. I remember it happening. I remember it being massive at the time of it happening.

But I didn't, there's a lot of that info that I didn't know. So, like, the stuff about the occult and all of that. Which is, it's just interesting to think about, like, where all of that came from as well.

And, like, the radicalization. And it would be interesting to know, sort of, like, what his... What the, sorry, was it called? Prevent. Prevent, yeah.

And the channel programme. Yeah, yeah. Like, what prevent was actually, like, what sort of radicalization they were looking into based on who he was.

Because he was a child at the time. Yeah. A lot of it is confidential and everything.

I don't understand the discharging of him from the programme. Yeah. When it was clear that he was still actively... Yeah.

Being on these forums and looking at far... Extremeest. Yeah. Content.

Whatever that extreme content is, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's still going to those extremes. Yeah.

But it's just like, I wonder if it's a case of... Is there something because it's almost like... Trying to pick my words. Is it something because of the sorts of stuff that he was looking at? So it was more on that kind of occult stuff. Is it almost like there's not the same level of taking that seriously? Potentially.

Yeah. When, and it's, you know, if it was, I don't know, looking at Al-Qaeda stuff or whatever, then potentially that would have been, oh, well, we know that that's dangerous because we've experienced that. And so that's, you know, but oh, he's just talking about a demon queen.

Oh, okay. Well, that's all. There you go.

That's fine. Don't really care anymore. I mean, negating the fact that a lot of extremist views are based in religious iconography, that form part of that.

But we'll just skip on past that bit. That's what I mean, right? Like... The fuck? Yeah. Just because he wasn't like googling how to be a terrorist.

Yeah. Doesn't mean. Like, you look at it holistically, right? You look at it as, what is this young person doing in totality over a period of time? Not, oh, they've stopped looking at that like discharge.

Yeah. Because he's still looking at fundamentally extreme things. Yeah.

And also, I kind of go, if you've, fine, if you need to discharge him from the active part of whatever that program is, okay. But the follow up. Yeah.

What's the follow up and what you do? It's not like... And who's responsibilities as well? Because that's what I couldn't really find out. Like, is it then on teachers? Yeah. Because he'll have been at the point where he was leaving school.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, is it... Does it go to a GP? Does it go to the local place? Like, where does it go? What happens in that situation? Because as well, it's almost like, I don't know. And again, like, never having experienced any of this myself.

Obviously, I could be talking absolute bullshit. But part of me feels a bit like, if they are at school and it is being managed in a program and they are getting better because they've got the support network and all the rest of it and it's being done well and I'm not saying that every school would do it well. But you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

That kind of would make sense to me. But I also think the fact that he was 17 would have been an even bigger risk factor. Because exactly as you've said, he's then going to be leaving that environment.

Exactly. And then what? And I just kind of think, like, if you've... I can't understand the process. I don't understand, not that I can't.

I don't understand the process. Because surely, if you've been vulnerable to radicalization once, you'd be vulnerable to it forever. Again, yeah.

Like, there must be something in the way you function or your mental health. Or nature, I don't know. But there is something that has allowed this vulnerability to be exploited.

I don't think that's going to be like six months of learning how to use the computer. But suppose it's a bit like something... Don't go on that site. Exactly.

I'm cured. But I think it's a bit like... I see it a bit like substance abuse. Because you can stop abusing substance abuse.

But you're never going to not be a substance. You're not going to ever have a risk around substances. You never... It's alcoholics.

It's everything, right? You're never recovered. No. You are always in recovery.

Exactly. And like, that's the same with eating disorders. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You don't get a recovered bulimid. No. Get a recovering bulimid.

Who will forever be recovering. But it's even as down as something stupid as like, you know, when you give up smoking, you're an ex-smoker. Yeah.

There is always that. You're an addict. You're an addict.

So to kind of go... Yeah, to your point around like, well, what is the sign that says, oh, no, that's it. I'm no longer... I'm no longer vulnerable to this anymore. Like, what? Oh, it's maddening.

Yeah, it's maddening. And that's like... Talking about this before we've even got to the fact of like, when you break it down a bit further, I don't know why it was in any way surprising to me, that a man thought he could commodify the lives of women for his own financial gain and the underlying misogyny and the message around that, right? That even in this insane scenario here, ultimately what you've got is man thinks women only valuable to him if it's providing something and he'll take it no matter what. And the idea that it was... He said six in six months.

What? Six every six months. So it would have been... Could have been. But also, the other thing I find quite interesting about the case is that... I don't know, we've joked about the South London, North London thing, but like, why Wembley? Why go... Was it because he assumed that it would be harder to trace him? Would it be, you know, did he know the park? Like, it's all... There's so many questions.

Maybe it's just close to the Jubilee line, eh? It's just in North Greenwich and was like, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, let's just work on this. I was going to say, thank you for what was an awful, awful case, incredibly well told, as per... Thanks babe.

And, yeah, yeah, it's a lot. Life, life, I think I'm going to need cider. I think that that is what's going to cure me today.

But on that note, lovely traverse, we've got some nice things to do at the end of the horrible case, and just chat to you and say, hi! And we are, as always, very appreciative of you. Thank you for those of you who have come to join us on the little Instagram. I'm hoping that's going to get even bigger.

I still haven't looked to TikTok. Website is up to date. It's sinisterselfpod.co.uk. It is up to date now because I made sure it was because I was very far behind in updating all the cases, but there's no live and you can email us at sinisterselfpodcast.gmail.com. Indeed you can.

Yeah. And do! Yeah, please do, it'll be lovely. Lovely to hear from you.

We also did, I was going to put this on here. We did a bit of a shout out for questions, which is very self-indulgent and completely, to me, completely hysterical. It might just be my mum being like, do you want to come for Sunday dinner? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mine would be Rachel. Where did you put this? Yeah, okay. But if anyone wants to email or DM any questions that you might have for us, we're considering how, when and where we do a Q&A.

Yeah. It may be a thing. Yeah, it will definitely all be in the new year, so you've got some time to think about it.

But yeah, do chat. Yeah. Do let us know.

Yeah. And again, I think we've said it before. I don't know how recently I'm getting confused with the order of podcasts now.

But if you do know of any cases that you would like us to cover. Yeah, do let us know. Or as Hannah has just expertly illustrated, they don't have to have taken place in South London.

We can have people who are from South London. So if you have anything that you'd like us to talk about, then please do let us know and we will add it to our case list for season two, which is coming in January. Yeah, basically we're saying season two.

It's essentially just that we need a couple of weeks off. We need a couple of weeks. So over Christmas of New Year, that's going to be the end of season one.

And season two starts on the 8th of January, I believe. Nice. So yeah.

I suppose all that's left to say then, my love is, well, thank you again. And Travis, we love you. We do love you.

And goodbye. Bye.